Don’t cheer for Pakistan’s cricket team if you are in India, you may be suspended or stabbed!

Published: March 6, 2014
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The local students were outraged by the Kashmiris’ support for the ‘enemy’ team. PHOTO: AFP

In a bizarre demonstration of overbearing nationalism, a university in Uttar Pradesh suspended 67 Kashmiri students for cheering for the Pakistani cricket team. This may be a clinical sign that the sore-loser syndrome has reached its terminal stage.

I don’t watch cricket. All I really know about the sport is that Pakistan won the match because Shakil Afridi, incidentally the same guy who found Osama, scored a last-minute goal (also called a ‘touchdown’).

I do know, though, that every India-Pakistan cricket match sends the neighbouring nations into a state of frenzy, which is quite natural. It doesn’t matter. As long as their skirmishes and battles are confined to the cricket stadium, I have no qualms with their passion.

Occasionally, that fervour spills out of the stadium into the real world, causing significant turbulence in our social and political lives. Swami Vivekanand Subharti University (SVSU) has policies as complicated and arcane as its name would suggest. The institution indefinitely suspended all Kashmiri students residing in Madan Dhingra hostel for applauding Pakistan’s victory in the cricket match.

The administration received complaints regarding some Kashmiri students yelling pro-Pakistani slogans and clapping whenever the Pakistani team scored. The Kashmiri students complained of angry Indian team supporters vandalising their rooms and damaging their property in retaliation. Only one of these complaints was dealt with seriously.

It’s like the time when New York’s Columbia University expelled a Chicago student for cheering the Chicago Bulls instead of New York Knicks during a basketball… oh, of course I’m kidding. There is no precedent, at least to my knowledge. A university cannot mandate which sports team a student may or may not support. The subcontinent, in this regard, is a universe of its own.

A three-tier inquiry at SVSU was appalled when the Kashmiri students refused to come forward and apologise for their behaviour. When they refused to give names of the students responsible for causing the uproar, all 67 Kashmiri students of the hostel were sent back to the valley.

The crime was not hooliganism; that, if any, is being attributed to the local students who were outraged by the Kashmiris’ support for the ‘enemy’ team. The most offensive part of the incident is the institution’s firm belief in its own imaginary magnanimity, that they sent these students back to the valley to secure them from the possible clashes. The attitude, it seems, is being shared by many parents of students at the university as well.

These are the same kind of wise policy-makers who would suspend a woman from work at the office in order to ‘protect her from harassment’. It does not occur to the administration to reprimand and punish the local students who are not evolved enough to tolerate a student’s support for an opposing team. The answer, instead, is to punish the victim and send him home.

Regrettably, this is not even the worst incident in the aftermath of the cricket match. In the Baramulla region of occupied Kashmir, a youth was stabbed to death by Indian forces for celebrating Pakistan’s victory. While this aggression will surely be bilaterally decried, this will not likely be the wake-up call to us on what jingoism could lead us to, just as thousands of tragedies before this weren’t.

I’ve learned from past experiences that whenever I say something marginally critical of anything Indian, I must also say something equally and irrelevantly critical of Pakistan so not to hurt an Indian friend’s pride.

So I would add, to burst my fellow Pakistanis’ bubble, that if somebody openly applauded the Indian team in a Pakistani university, he too would be treated rather poorly. Would he get suspended? Depending on the university, quite possibly, though that hasn’t happened yet as far as I’m aware. If it does happen, I would condemn that wholeheartedly as well.

SVSU’s immaturity deserves no apologists. A university’s vice-chancellor should not be concerned with which sports team I cheer for or which Game of Thrones character I root for. If anybody is to be punished, it should be the one not capable of tolerating diversity of thought at the campus.

Do you think Pakistanis would react aggressively towards supporters of the Indian cricket team in Pakistan?

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Faraz Talat

Faraz Talat

A medical doctor and bubble-wrap enthusiast from Rawalpindi, who writes mostly about science and social politics (and bubble-wrap). He tweets @FarazTalat (twitter.com/FarazTalat)

The views expressed by the writer and the reader comments do not necessarily reflect the views and policies of The Express Tribune.

  • Irony

    I am an Indian. This is totally ridiculous. This shld never have happened and its embarrassing.Recommend

  • Irony

    I am an Indian. This is totally ridiculous. This shld never have happened and its embarrassing.Recommend

  • Irony

    I am an Indian. This is totally ridiculous. This shld never have happened and its embarrassing.Recommend

  • Hassam

    you wouldn’t get more neutral media group in Pakistan, trust me.Recommend

  • gp65

    Charging with sedition was silly and clearly not tenable under Indian law. As can be expected, the CM of the state that these students hailed from spoke out against this and the government of India withdrew the sedition petition. If the government had not done so, the courts wold have thrown it out since it was not maintainable. When Geelani who gives fiery anti-India speeches was acquitted of sedition charges – where is the question of these kids getting convicted?
    I just feel that this was an example of Samajwadi Party indulging in one wrong (filing baseless charges against the kids) to correct another wrong (ongoing appeasement of Mullahs) as the election in around the corner and they realize that they had tilted too far in one direction.
    I must say that I am disappointed that these boys cannot find it in their hearts to be loyal to India even as they enjoy full advantages of Indian citizenship including scholarships in other states. However disappointment is very different from sedition. These boys were clearly not guilty of sedition. The corrective mechanism of democracy have kicked in and the charges have been withdrawn.
    Having said that I certainly would like to share a related article with you. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Backing-India-lands-PoK-leaders-in-jail/articleshow/8009074.cms?referral=PM

    Oh – and contrary to your usual comments to me – I am NOT a lawyer :)Recommend

  • gp65

    It is unclear why you dragged BJP in this mess? This happened in UP and last I checked BJP does not govern in UP. In fact it is the so called secular messiah Mulayam Singh’s party which is in charge.
    For someone as knowledgeable as you are you really ought to rein in your hatred for BJP which makes you make completely irrelevant points – very uncharacteristic of you.
    As expected the sedition case has been withdrawn. But with your knowledge you must have known that there was 0 % chance that the boys would be convicted for sedition – considering that even Geelani was not acquitted of a sedition charge.Recommend

  • gp65

    The students are NOT suspended for cheering India. They have been temporarily sent back to Kashmir for their own protection since their Hindustan Murdabad slogans have not endeeared them to their fellow students. You must realize that this is a riot prone area and firm pre-emptive action is necessary to avoid riots.
    Once things calm down, the fellow involved in creating unrest will be dealt with separately. For the rest of the 67 it will be BAU – though they may have lost some friends.
    Cheering any team is fine. Shouting Hindustan Murdabad is very disappointing from people who are studuing in another Indian state using scholarships from government of India. But even that does not qualify as being seditious. Sure enough government of India has withdrawn the sedition petition.Recommend

  • gp65

    People CAN choose cricket teams. fyi – I find your story very difficult to believe given how scared non-Muslims are in Pakistan. Incidentally, if you think there were no consequences for people cheering for India in world cup 2011, please read this, http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Backing-India-lands-PoK-leaders-in-jail/articleshow/8009074.cms?referral=PMRecommend

  • gp65

    Faraz , Please provide reference for the statement that a student was stabbed for cheering the Indian team.
    Secondly some students were shouting Hindustan Murdabad which definitely did not endear them to their fellow students. They have been sent back temporarily to their home state for THEIR protection. They will be back soon. I will say this though that shouting fire in a crowded hall is not smart.
    Finally the sedition petition was ab initio wrong and sure enough has been withdrawn.Recommend

  • gp65

    Were these families also shouting Pakistan Murdabad – because for the comparison to hold, that is necessary. Those kids in UP WERE shouting Hindustan Murdabad.Recommend

  • gp65

    The students will nto be punished. They have been temporarily sent back to their homes because they have clearly alienated their fellow students and passions are running high.
    As you maybe aware the sedition petition has already been repealed.Recommend

  • gp65

    How is this a preview of Modi? Modi has ruled Gujarat riot free for 12 years. UP where this incident happened was not ruled by BJPRecommend

  • gp65

    Oh so the military establishment of Pakistan does not represent 180 million Pakistanis but some low level police official in Indian city of Meerut DOES represent 1.2 billion Indians as this article seems to imply?Recommend

  • Srinagar Bloke

    For the correct version of events, please go visit TimesofIndia’s website where they reported this news with interviews:

    1. The Kashmiri boys were being constantly booed at by their ‘other’ counterparts. It continued for quite a while. And then India lost. I mean there had to be a reaction..!
    2. They were CHASED, HURLED STONES AT, THREATENED OF CONSEQUENCES AND BEATEN. And WHY??
    3. Safe custody? HAHAHA.. Good one! actually they were ‘expelled’. WHY ON EARTH??
    4. Lie it or not, Kashmir is NOT a part of India. I challenge all commentors from indians here to take the first plane/bus to Held Kashmir and ask the first people they meet about what the feel about india. I am sure you know that already.
    Thousands of rapes and extra-judicial killings and you expect Kashmiris to cheer for you!?Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    The credibility of Pakistan is irrelevant. The topic is about what India did, not what Pakistan does or might have done.

    You cannot distract the forum from India’s issues by constantly yelling, “…but look at Pakistan/Muslims instead!”.

    Give credit where credit is due, and scorn whatever needs to be scorned.Recommend

  • jin

    ET published an article in favour of Pakistani that does not even bash Pakistan for a change. Who else is surprised?Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    Pakistan or Kashmiri separatism is completely irrelevant. No matter how much you try to complicate and rationalize the shameful acts of the government and police, the basic facts still remain: kids who cheered for a different country in a cricket game are now facing sedition charges, and one fan was stabbed to death by security forces. No amount of reflexive finger pointing and tiptoeing around the issue will change those basic facts.Recommend

  • Reddy

    Would you be OK if I come to Pakistan and shout anti Islam slogans as part of freedom of speech while studying on your dime?Recommend

  • Reddy

    Some of you Pakis don’t get the point. These students are using our resources (some of them have scholarships others get subsidized education) while bashing us. How would you feel if I come to your home eat your food and spit on you?Recommend

  • Ali

    Jealousy, Inferiority Complex and deceit is in India’s blood. No Matter how hard we try, we cant change that. Forget Kashmiris, even local Indian Muslims cheer for Pakistan in cities like Hyderabad, Luckhow etc.Recommend

  • Reddy

    So you let them go when they try to incite violence by disturbing religious harmony? If they really feel for Paki cricket team they should move Paki land and study on their dime. Recommend

  • Rakib

    It’s nice to read of such bonhomie. But do ask yourself whether you would have described those 20-30 Hindu/Sikh families of Mandi Bahauddin in such affectionate terms if you knew (or suspected) them to be potential Separatists, or such that didn’t believe in ideology of Pakistan or didn’t accept Islamic character of Pak or loved your neighbour more & so on. It need not actually be so at all; I am only saying if you merely suspected (even wrongly) it to be so. Once doubts takes control, every action & word is looked at thru the prism of suspicion. When love is thin faults are thick. Rudimentary lesson in inter-personal relationship. Your Hindu/Sikh friends are worthy friends because they don’t do anything & you don’t suspect them of anything that may put relationship under strain. But,Kashmiris & other Indians have major relationship problems to solve & attitude shown by some of the both does not help.Recommend

  • water bottle

    That has to be the most unnecessary reply to an irrelevant comment I’ve ever had the misfortune to read on the internet, before making my own reply. Hats off to you.Recommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com/ Anoop

    No Kashmiri non-Muslim will even think of supporting Pakistan.

    This Kashmiris support Pakistan thing is purely based on Religion.

    I wonder why the Buddhists of Ladakh or Hindus and Sikhs of Jammu will support Pakistan.

    Considering all the wonderful times such themes have brought since independence, especially in the past 20 years, is it really a smart idea to gloat?

    If a Kashmiri feels he is better of with Pakistan(I am Religion has nothing do with it, he is a thoroughly secular, modern fellow), and, this is the important part, thinks he has majority support, all he has to do is stand in the elections and ask for him to elected.

    Does anyone have a problem with proving their majority? Until then, this is an Islamist problem, which India has been dealing with since the last century, which Pakistan is actively dealing with every second of every day.Recommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com/ Anoop

    One guy stands in the middle of London and asks for the implementation of Sharia. Does that count? Does he represent the majority?

    I am not disagreeing with you that the Sedition law is just plain wrong and has to be done with. That also means the treatment meted out to these young fellows was wrong.

    You seem to imply that most Indians are right-wing and have their priorities all wrong.

    But, you seem to forget one important thing(I am paraphrasing MJ Akbar) : India is secular and free not because its minorities want it to be, but the majority Hindus want it to be.

    On the overall question of morality and behaviour, India and Indians stand above and beyond the criticism of any offsprings of Two Nation Theory.

    Over the years I’ve seen articles on the apathy of poor Palestinians, Muslims of Myanmar, Kashmiris(read Kashmiri Muslims), but never, ever, a line about Kashmiri Pandits on any major Pakistani publication.

    If you see yourself as so high and mighty and moral, why don’t you write an article explaining why Kashmiri Pandits left the valley and why are they staying in Refugee camps all over India? Do you have it in you and do you think ET is free enough to discuss this openly?Recommend

  • paki

    Do you think Pakistanis would react aggressively towards supporters of the Indian cricket team in Pakistan?

    Pakistan has a large number of people who hate the country the reside in and like parasites have brought it to it’s current state. A lot of people support India, disagree with the partition and have no ownership whatsoever of pakistan socially, culturally, politically.Recommend

  • water bottle

    Political maturity? What has it got to do with that? It wasn’t the decision of a political party or the government.

    Recommend

  • Amna Abbaasi

    Kindly see below Indian paper headline.
    Now what you(Indian) will say about your freedom of speech.
    Specially Mr Amir I am giving you the complete version.

    The Times of India
    In Srinagar, students tell a different story
    “We were watching the match with other students in the university campus,” Mateef Ahmad recounted. “But as soon as the match ended and Pakistan won, there were abuses flying around. When we (the Kashmiri students) were moving towards our hostel, they (the non-Kashmiri group) followed us and then pelted stones which resulted in the breakage of the window panes of our hostel rooms.”

    Another student, Shahid Shah, said that the college administration was misleading the media by saying it was the Kashmiri students who had raised the pro-Pakistan slogans. “It is totally wrong,” Shah said. “We just ran toward our rooms when the fighting erupted. We feared for our lives.Recommend

  • Mohammad Amir

    How will you Pakistanis treat slogans like Pakistan Murdabad and attack on the character of Rasool Allah. Will you welcome or have pakistanis welcomed such slogans. Pakistan has its own red line for freedom of speech and we Indians have our own.

    Mohammad Amir
    New Delhi IndiaRecommend

  • water bottle

    Pakistanis are nationalistic?

    Don’t make me laugh hard. I haven’t had my breakfast yet.

    Pakistanis don’t know what their country is. To most Pakistanis, Pakistan is Punjab/Sindh/Balochistan etc.

    Pakistanis are only extremists with fake nationalism. Pakistanis are only united against India.

    Seriously, Pakistanis are the most confused people about their own identity.Recommend

  • water bottle

    Let me answer you in the simplest term.

    There would be violence as a retaliation to what the other students perceived as anti-India behavior.

    Does the constitution lets them be violent? No.

    Do people get violent? Yes.

    Until all INdians are educated enough to deal with Kashmiris like Israel deals with Palestine, these measures have to be taken.

    Why do you think, Hindus don’t get to take Ganesha processions in some streets in their own country?Recommend

  • water bottle

    Let me answer you in the simplest term.

    There would be violence as a retaliation to what the other students perceived as anti-India behavior.

    Does the constitution lets them be violent? No.

    Do people get violent? Yes.

    Until all INdians are educated enough to deal with Kashmiris like Israel deals with Palestine, these measures have to be taken.

    Why do you think, Hindus don’t get to take Ganesha processions in some streets in their own country?Recommend

  • water bottle

    sedition charges are not justifiable. It was a move by the corrupt Mulayam Singh’s government (though his son is the ceo), to win over Hindu votes.

    everybody is feeling insecure of Modi and want to outdo BJP.

    It was politically motivated and INdia being the sensible country that it is, has forced the government to withdraw it.Recommend

  • water bottle

    sedition charges are not justifiable. It was a move by the corrupt Mulayam Singh’s government (though his son is the ceo), to win over Hindu votes.

    everybody is feeling insecure of Modi and want to outdo BJP.

    It was politically motivated and INdia being the sensible country that it is, has forced the government to withdraw it.Recommend

  • water bottle

    Which part of my comment you did not understand?

    Let me make it clear.

    These 67 students were suspended because they were creating trouble by chanting anti India slogans.

    They were sent home to protect them. Did you even read the whole article before writing the blog. Most of them had no money. The college used its own money to send them as far away along with the escort of three of college staffers.

    What is excuse in that? I don’t understand.

    Also, in case you don’t know, every country has the concept of protective custody.

    Thank god the vc was smart enough not to send them to protective custody, or you would be writing, Kashmiris jailed for supporting Pak cricket.Recommend

  • water bottle

    Which part of my comment you did not understand?

    Let me make it clear.

    These 67 students were suspended because they were creating trouble by chanting anti India slogans.

    They were sent home to protect them. Did you even read the whole article before writing the blog. Most of them had no money. The college used its own money to send them as far away along with the escort of three of college staffers.

    What is excuse in that? I don’t understand.

    Also, in case you don’t know, every country has the concept of protective custody.

    Thank god the vc was smart enough not to send them to protective custody, or you would be writing, Kashmiris jailed for supporting Pak cricket.Recommend

  • water bottle

    come back to Earth and read news daily.

    sedition charges have been withdrawn.

    I appreciate you perspective. They are not facts. They are lies.

    Now be patient to understand the facts…

    The trouble-mongers who shouted anti india slogans with the malicious intent of vitiating the atmosphere have been temporarily suspended and sent home to avoid any riots.Recommend

  • water bottle

    come back to Earth and read news daily.

    sedition charges have been withdrawn.

    I appreciate you perspective. They are not facts. They are lies.

    Now be patient to understand the facts…

    The trouble-mongers who shouted anti india slogans with the malicious intent of vitiating the atmosphere have been temporarily suspended and sent home to avoid any riots.Recommend

  • water bottle

    Stop repeating sedition, sedition, sedition. You sound like Musharraf.

    The charges were politically motivated and they have been withdrawn.

    At least show the honesty to read news regularly.Recommend

  • water bottle

    Stop repeating sedition, sedition, sedition. You sound like Musharraf.

    The charges were politically motivated and they have been withdrawn.

    At least show the honesty to read news regularly.Recommend

  • water bottle

    the credibility of Pakistan is relevent to the comment.

    Please read the comments again.

    Mr. Talat, you should learn to read a chain of comments. Not read one or two selectively.

    I have written everything w.r.t what this gentleman here said.Recommend

  • water bottle

    the credibility of Pakistan is relevent to the comment.

    Please read the comments again.

    Mr. Talat, you should learn to read a chain of comments. Not read one or two selectively.

    I have written everything w.r.t what this gentleman here said.Recommend

  • Deka

    Shouting anti India/ hindu slogans in India gets you booked; shouting anti islam slogans in pakistan gets you killed. India is bad, pakistan is worse; lets try to make both countries better than arguing about ridiculous frivolitiesRecommend

  • Deka

    Shouting anti India/ hindu slogans in India gets you booked; shouting anti islam slogans in pakistan gets you killed. India is bad, pakistan is worse; lets try to make both countries better than arguing about ridiculous frivolitiesRecommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    And you obviously are just parroting what everybody does these days in India. A referendum was promised to Kashmiris, but it was never given, this is an unresolved issue and has surfaced every now and then in various forms. What you’ve stated is just a side effect.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    And you obviously are just parroting what everybody does these days in India. A referendum was promised to Kashmiris, but it was never given, this is an unresolved issue and has surfaced every now and then in various forms. What you’ve stated is just a side effect.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    “There must be a reason why Kashmiris identify more with a troubled and unstable Pakistan…”

    I won’t make a sweeping statement like this if I were you. Perhaps, you might want to go through this – http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/2017631.stm

    Here is an excerpt…

    “And on the crucial question of nationality 9% of those in and around Srinagar said they would be better off staying Indian, while 13% would opt to become citizens of Pakistan.

    But the vast majority around Srinagar, 78%, showed no enthusiasm for being part of either country, saying they did not know.”Recommend

  • Noman Ansari

    haha I just kid around. :)Recommend

  • Noman Ansari

    haha I just kid around. :)Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    “Government has done several mistakes, including rigging elections and keeping the guns out on the streets.”

    If you agree to this, then why can’t we have a decent debate on this topic without slanders on our news channels? This is where the Indian civilians are at fault. Everytime this issue comes up, we just talk about Kashmiri Pandits and beheading of the Indian soldiers. Do you remember Prashant Bhushan episode, when he talked about referendum and was blasted left, right and center? Can a person, not even express his/her views, no matter how contrary they are, to the popular sentiments?

    The problem in our country is, everybody has a false sense of nationalism, and here is why,
    1. People would evade taxes at every opportunity, not just businessmen, but professionals too, by submitting fake bills.
    2. People just won’t follow rules, be it traffic or societal norms in general.
    3. Very few would be genuinely interested in random acts of kindness, without expecting anything in return.

    I’m not taking a high moral ground here, because I’m not perfect, however, I’m not bigoted either, or delusional about nationalism.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    It’s good to see some sane voices from fellow Indians, in this mêlée.Recommend

  • baig

    i see a grave violation of human rights in there. no freedom of speech in the largest democracy in the world. well they not were picking up guns and shooting anyone.Recommend

  • Rakib

    India Today has reported on BJP burning effigies of University Admin demanding action. ( BTW: You may recall Modi allowing filing of Sedition cases (19 of them!) against Editor Times of India!! That’s how vindictive BJP is! Cases were thrown out by the courts.) Election fever causes one-upmanship especially if the challenger (BJP) too creates pressure. If Bajarang Dal is let loose on Muslims by Modi’s henchman Amit Shah who is in charge of UP there will be havoc & SP is no match considering Amit Shah is a trained rioter of 2002 who is not allowed by Court to enter Gujarat. Also, Internet will show you India Today headline story “BJP demands action against suspended Kashmiri students of Meerut university” It says, inter alia, “BJP leaders on Wednesday burnt the effigy of the university administration and organised a protest in the city. They have also given a three- day ultimatum to the police administration to book these students for ” their involvement in anti- national activities.” BJP district vice- president Ajit Chaudhary said, ” Google some more, I can’t provide links since ET may reject it.Recommend

  • ppl

    Dear Worlds biggest democracy,
    Try to tolerate atleast try, they are Indian like you. The Motherland is not the dirt underneath your feet it is the people around you.Recommend

  • Immi k

    The word lawyer has been thrown around many times for people here. Noman Ansari called you a lawyer only once.

    Most people don’t have a high opinion of you. Who do you think we are referring to when we say “Indian readers on Et can never accept India’s faults “Recommend

  • Mohammad Amir

    I am regular visitor to Meerut region and the news presented in mainstream media are also dissected as per requirement. the fact is there was Anti India slogan raised.Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    You’ve completely lost me, I’m afraid.

    Nobody here is silly enough to believe that you did the Kashmiri students a favor by suspending them from their university. If the university is filled with goons who attack people for supporting the Pakistani cricket team or booing the Indian one, then it’s the goons who need to be chucked out of the institution for everybody’s sake.Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    Anybody struggling to see the problem with the university’s decision is invited to consider the following hypothetical scenario:

    “The Lahore University Of Management Sciences has suspended 56 Hindu students for cheering for the Indian cricket team on campus. Some were reported to have yelled ‘Vande Matram’ which angered many Pakistani students. The administration claims it suspended all Hindu students in the boys’ hostel for their own safety.”Recommend

  • UHS

    Hahahaha… then you must have problem with ‘touch down’ and ‘goal’ as well.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    “Come on ET atleast tell me what part of that you found offensive.”

    On a lighter note, this is one answer you would never get. I’ve tried and failed miserably. We have a better chance of resolving Kashmir issue.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    True that!

    This is exactly what our politicians do, justifying, if X party did it some way, so can the Y party. This is why our democracy and polity is a sham.Recommend

  • wajid

    Mr water bottle, you are full of toxic waterRecommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    “pseudo democratic country”… unfortunate, but true.Recommend

  • Rakib

    The hypothetical example gets complicated if the “Hindu” Students were otherwise believed to be “Separatists” from a “disputed” province of “Pakistan” from where “Muslims” would have been cast out, and the boys susceptible to incitement by “India”.Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    Do you truly expect me to believe that the university did the Kashmiri students a favor by suspending them? Instead of suspending the goons threatening the campus with violence?

    Nobody believes that. Not even you.

    “You cannot pass judgement against your own national team” said the Vice Chancellor, explaining why the administration had to suspend the students. And India’s own reports suggest that it was the ‘Pakistan Zindabad’ not ‘Hindustan Murdabad’ shouts that outraged the campus.

    Can we please stop being apologists for immature actions? Admit it: if a Pakistani university had done this to Hindu students cheering the Indian team, you would have complained.Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    Victim-blaming.

    “Oh, maybe if the Kashmiri students didn’t want to be threatened with violence and suspended from the universities, they should not have exercised their freedom of expression to support the sports team of their own choice.”Recommend

  • Rakib

    @ Faraz Talat: The foregoing is not to suggest, even remotely, that I endorse the action of University or Admin. I am merely pointing out that it’s impossible to come up with an identical situation involving Pakistani Hindu students. Kashmiris case is complex & unique. If Hyderabadi or Lucknawi Muslim students had done this (which is totally unlikely) VC might not have even got out of the bed & would have asked the hostel warden to handle it. It would have led to few fisticuffs & scraped knuckles among boys, that’s all, & that’s good for all.Recommend

  • Yoyo

    If you want India to deal with Kashmir as Israel deals with Palestine, then I am genuinely terrified of “ultra nationalists” like you who have no regard for human dignity — just because the “other” is not “Indian” enough for you, they automatically deserve to be put under military occupation with controlled supplies and freedom of movement/speech. I hope the next generation in India isn’t as radical as you. Peace to all.Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    I’m talking about the political maturity of the people, i.e. the ability to handle criticism. Get it.Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    This “water bottle” guy is hopeless. The argument is going in circles, and he refuses to admit that what happened was wrong. Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    Again with the reflexive finger-pointing. Are you people really that immature? And how do you know I “donot praech” freedom of speech? My entire life I’ve been consistently opposed to the blasphemy law, and I’ve been involved with Christian solidarity groups in my province. It really is quite pathetic what I’m seeing here: normally rational Indians defending something that is absolutely unforgivable.Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    We’re splitting hairs, don’t you think?

    The Kashmiri students weren’t rioting for Kashmir’s separation, so that’s entirely irrelevant. All they did was support the Pakistani cricket team (according to NewYorkTimes, one of the suspended student specifically said that the only thing he admired about Pakistan was the cricket team).

    Not to mention that most of the 67 suspended students did absolutely nothing, except share an ethnicity with the handful who had the audacity to cheer for Pakistan or boo the Indian team.

    I see that you do not support the university’s actions, and that’s pretty much all I’m asking. I know SVSU’s actions do not represent India, but the way so many Indians have reacted to this news has done nothing to ease our minds.Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    Yes, in fact, I would LOVE it if someone came to a Pakistani school and spoke whatever came to their mind. It would be a testament to our freedom.Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    I don’t even know how to respond to that. Freedom of speech means, well, FREEDOM OF SPEECH. WIthout the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    Um, okay? Pakistanis aren’t nationalistic? That’s a very good thing to say about us, even though it’s not true. Thanks for the compliment, anyway, though.Recommend

  • Malaika Harris

    I hope you realized the irony in writing this comment, bigot.Recommend

  • TheAverageMoe

    Your comment is actually nonfactual and biased, if you ever cared about studying Kashmiri history, you would learn that Kashmiris(of all faiths) have been fighting for freedom since 1586 and they continued to strive for freedom under various different rulers, the last one before partition being the Dogras(who were considered foreigners in Kashmir) and they’re currently fighting for freedom under their new colonizers(india)..

    A religious dimension was added to the Kashmir cause in 1947 as according to the rules of partition, all the Muslim majority states were supposed to merge with Pakistan, Kashmir being majority Muslim should have merged with Pakistan but it didn’t because of their ruler Hari SIngh, you should look up the Poonch rebellion, that started on 18 August 1947, and the people of Kashmir wanted to overthrow their dictator, Nehru knew about this and he didn’t want to publicize this fact, Christopher Snedden about book about this.

    http://www.greaterkashmir.com/

    You speak about the massacre and expulsion of Kashmiri Pandits which is condemn-able, however you are unaware of the Jammu massacre of 1947, when over 200,000 Kashmiri Muslims were killed and many were forced to flee and settle in Pakistan(mostly in Punjab), before the massacre, Jammu was 61% Muslim but today it is less than 25%.

    Many more Muslims were expelled by the Dogras from Jammu throughout the 19th and early-20th centuries, and that is why there is a very big Kashmiri diaspora in Sialkot and Gujranwala.

    The massacre of Kashmiri Pandits was bad however Kashmiri Pandits never made up more 5% of Kahsmir’s population(and still do), so they would have little influence in a plebiscite.

    BTW You also completely ignored the UN resolution of 1953, in which India was ordered to grant the people of Kashmir the right to self-determination, so if Kashmiris do feel alienated, it’s because India never fulfilled it’s promise.Recommend

  • TheAverageMoe

    You’re dead wrong, in fact there are many ignorant people in Pakistan that actually expect Pakistani-Hindus to root for India!Recommend

  • TheAverageMoe

    i love assumptions!Recommend

  • TheAverageMoe

    Your “resources”?If you don’t want Kashmiris living off your “resources”, then grant them independence!Recommend

  • someone

    I think it would not have been an issue if they were just supporting or clapping for Pakistani team. Issue started when they started Anti India slogans. Now a bunch of people, who are sent to study in the university in India on the money of the Indian tax payers, should not shout anti India slogans and should have had some shame.Recommend

  • TheAverageMoe

    Muslims do make up 95% of Kashmir’s population, so an overwhelming majority of Kashmiris do support team Pakistan, and I don’t think it’s religiously motivated otherwise Indian-Muslims would have been rooting for team Pakistan too, you claim the Kashmir cause is an “Islamist problem” but you’re ignorant of the fact that the Kashmiri Muslims follow sufism, not deobandism, and they’ve been fighting for freedom since 1586!Go look up the Poonch rebellion, that’s what got the struggle for secession from India rolling even before Pakistan sent tribesmen in, Nehru didn’t want to publicize.

    “If a Kashmiri feels he is better of with Pakistan(I am Religion has nothing do with it, he is a thoroughly secular, modern fellow), and, this is the important part, thinks he has majority support, all he has to do is stand in the elections and ask for him to elected.”

    You seriously believe that a Kashmiri separatist would be allowed to contest free and fair elections in India?!Most leaders for Kashmiri freedom are either dead,missing or in exile, and even if they are allowed to take part in a plebiscite, it would have a high chance of being rigged, the only way it would be fair is if Jammu & Kashmir is completely demilitarized by both India and Pakistan and a plebiscite is held with int’l observers.

    PS There are many secular and modern Kashmiris that support secession.Recommend

  • someone

    Well last thing we need is a lecture about “secularism” and democracy coming from a Pakistani where “youtube” is still banned.Recommend

  • gp65

    Yes I figured. I too wanted to end a serious post on a slightly lighter note.Recommend

  • gp65

    I asked you for a reference to the stabbing which you referred to in your headline and you chose to sidestep that issue.
    Secondly, the fact the environment in Meerut has had high communal sensitivity based on several small and big clashes is extremely unfortunate. It is in context of this environment that some way of temporarily diffusing the tensions was necessary. Whether this was the best way to do it – I am not an expert – in fact in my opinion it was a suboptimal way just as Rehman Malik used to switch cellphones off.
    Plus India is not just that police guy who filed the petition. India is also the CM of Kashmir who spoke up for the boys, it is also government of India which withdrew the petition, it is also the media which made a big deal of the absurd sedition petition, it is also the court system which has even acquitted Geelani who has made anti-India speeches and would surely have acquitted these boys. India is also the government that gives scholarships to Kashmiri boys to study wherever they want in India. To make broad sweeping stereotypes is improper.Recommend

  • abhi

    This is totally hypothetical becuase having 56 hindus in a pakistani university is a tough task.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    I’m hopeful that after a couple of generations, such discussions would be a thing of past and meaningless. Unfortunately, some of us won’t be around to witness it ;)Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    Regarding point 3, if I pay a fairly good amount of income tax, I’m allowed to shout slogans and criticize India, which btw, I do, publicly, at times. I don’t give a crap about anybody while doing it because I’m a Punjabi Hindu, but a Kashmiri Muslim needs to exercise caution?Recommend

  • AryaMahalingami

    Lets not ignore the silver linning of this incident. This is the first time Pakistan have lived up to its founding premise by inviting these Muslim students. Pakistani Govt and people have shown their religious greatness by setting this precedence and lets hope they keep their words in future and show hearts big enough to accomodate all those millions of Muslims who will now run toward Wagha to take advantage of this economic and religious freedom and opportunity. I and i ams sure many genuine Indians too will not mind shouting Pakistan Zindabad if Pakistan and its great Isalmic people live upto to this ideal of being true homeland for South Asian Muslims as dreamed by great Quaid.Recommend

  • Amy

    Don’t mind me. Pakistanis are infamous as liars. Some American even called Pakistanis pathological liars.Recommend

  • Amy

    !stop being a TROLL and a sore loser!ACCEPT your mistakes; don’t try to mudsling others!two wrongs don’t make a rightRecommend

  • Amy

    if you wanna talk about pakistan like that, then india is the same!cause NORTH and SOUTH indians are not united!I know this from experience as I have friends from both north and south india.I have even seen them fight on online forums etc.so that means that even indians don’t know what their country isRecommend

  • Abbas

    Absolutely WELL Said gp65. Recommend

  • water bottle

    Those who want to be lost on broad day light cannot be found in the dark of the night.Recommend

  • thruthseeker

    Few points
    1,This whole issue has turned into hindu v muslim thing, I am lumping other minorities with hindus. That’s what it is, even Kashmir is same,
    2, India is prone to communal riots (muzzafer nagar) These students must have realised the consequence
    3, they are suspended not dismissed. lets be honest here they will not be missed.
    4, When things cool down and if they decide to come, no one can or will stop them
    5′ this whole thing kicked off because they shouted anti india slogans, which I would like to point out is not same as cheering pakistan
    6, They could and should have tried to diffuse the situation by saying something on the lines of they got carried over in the heat of the moment therefore did not realise the effect on patriotic Indians. not a apology, you can cheer whoever you like, little common-sense and consideration should be shown, they can do this even now. will they?
    7, there is freedom of expression in India, I don’t see any muslims complaining when books are banned in india (satanic verses, lajja etc) coin has two sides
    8 , whenever there is clash between law and order and freedom of expression , law and order should come first.
    9, every time man city play man u, supporters are separated by police, if small group of city supporters were to chant anti man u chants in man utd crowd, this people will be charged by police for inciting
    10 something like this will never happen in Pakistan. I will leave to you to imagine why and if its a good thingRecommend

  • Spock

    You mean to tell me that if pakistani kashmiri cheer for india in lahore then pakistan would greet them with open arms? Or people cheer for israel, ahmadis over pakistan then you would hug them?

    Atleast in India they are only suspended for 3 daysRecommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com/ Anoop

    If overwhelming people support Kashmir why did they vote en masse in Indian elections?

    http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB123048366626337803

    If it was not free and fair why did this separatist a member of a hurriat faction app stand in election and lost? Even he didn’t question he fairness of Elections.

    http://in.reuters.com/article/2009/05/16/idINIndia-39670020090516

    Kashmir is only Muslim because of massive migration of Kashmiri Pandits out of Kashmir for the fear of Jihadis. The same exact reason why Pakistani Hindus are seeking refuge in India.

    Nice idea, isn’t it. Drive all the Hindus and Sikhs and Budhists out of Kashmir and claim Kashmir is majority Muslim! Orwell’s Big Brother would be proud.

    Election commission of India is super powerful and constitutionally independent. Even your own election commission invited India’s representative to advice on the process.

    Vote rigging and cheating is as impossible in India as Pakistan ridding itself of Taliban. Even the separatist who lost the election or the people who came to vote dont think so, but Pakistanis do. When the mind is fixated on something it is very hard to remap itself to new realities.

    P.S. Just so that you don’t accuse the links I provide to be biased I’m providing links of International publications. I hope you don’t accuse Reuters of rigging its stories!Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    It’s not about a low-level police officer. It’s about a university suspending students for supporting the wrong cricket team, and the fact that hordes of Indians are acting as apologists for their immature actions doesn’t help the case.

    It goes without saying that a single university or random policeman does not represent all Indians. But the response to the actions does signify a culture of intolerance and rampant jingoism.Recommend

  • Faraz Talat

    You may google the references yourself, though frankly, sporadic cases of violence aren’t really what bother me the most (it was the editor’s decision to include the stabbing incident).

    What bothers me is the culture of jingoism, as I stated earlier, which is more clearly demonstrated by the university’s actions followed by the general Indian response.

    I’m not a fan of Rehman Malik’s enmity with our cell phone connections. I’ve been quite vocal about my disagreement with such measures.

    I’m obviously not accusing all Indians of being jingoists. I personally know many Indians who are ardently supporting the Kashmiris right to free expression and protest. What I am lamenting, is a culture that many Indians (like many, many Pakistanis) have fallen prey to.Recommend

  • https://www.facebook.com/shail.arora.589 Shail Arora

    Fair point.Recommend