Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Jinnah wanted to create

Published: March 16, 2013

The Bangladeshi youth demands banning the Jamaat-e-Islami from politics and boycotting of institutions supporting or affiliated with Jamaat-e-Islami PHOTO: REUTERS

When East Pakistan decided to break away from West Pakistan in 1971, one of the leading factors was the lack of importance accorded by West Pakistan’s bureaucracy and intelligentsia towards the other part of the country. It is not a surprise that the attitude did not change even after the separation of Pakistan’s two wings.

Pakistan’s textbooks are still silent over the atrocities committed by our armed forces and their proxies in 1971. Although West Pakistan may have forgotten, but the people who were subjected to the inhumane behaviour just because they dreamt of a better future, remember it all too vividly.

The demand to prosecute the criminals from 1971 has reverberated in Bangladesh over the years. It was only in 2009 that an International Crimes Tribunal (ICT) was formed set up in Bangladesh to investigate and prosecute suspects for the atrocities committed in 1971.

It should also be noted that Bangladesh’s original constitution of 1972 had declared it a secular state but the 8th amendment, put in effect by General Hussain Mohammad Ershad in 1988, declared Islam as the state religion of Bangladesh. Interestingly, Pakistan also had a notorious 8th amendment to the 1973 constitution, giving the power to dissolve assemblies to the president, put in place by none other than General Ziaul Haq.

In 2010, the Bangladesh High Court declared the constitutional amendment that had changed the country’s secular status to that of an Islamic state was done without lawful authority. This is still pending in the Supreme Court.

It is against this background that the current Shahbag movement should be seen. It started on February 5, 2013 – the day Bangladesh’s ICT awarded a life sentence to Abdul Quader Molla nicknamed ‘Butcher of Mirpur’ for his part in the mass murder and rape of Bengalis in 1971. He is a senior leader of Bangladesh’s Jamaat-e-Islami.

A few days earlier, Delwar Hossain Sayeedi, also a senior leader of Jamaat-e-Islami Bangladesh, was sentenced to death on February 28 for war crimes committed during the 1971 Liberation War.

Bangladeshi youth has taken it upon themselves to protest the leniency of the decision awarded to Molla and have taken to gathering at a Dhaka city compound in droves since the past few weeks.

People attend a mass demonstration at Shahbagh intersection, demanding capital punishment for Bangladesh's Jamaat-e-Islami senior leader Abdul Quader Mollah, after a war crimes tribunal sentenced him to life imprisonment, in Dhaka February 8, 2013. REUTERS-Andrew Biraj

The youth instead has demanded an “exemplary punishment”. They also demand to ban the Jamaat-e-Islami from politics and to boycott institutions supporting or affiliated with Jamaat-e-Islami.

This is a unique moment in modern history of the youth rising up against an Islamist religio-political party due to their agenda.

People attend a mass demonstration at Shahbagh intersection, demanding capital punishment for Bangladesh's Jamaat-e-Islami senior leader Abdul Quader Mollah, after a war crimes tribunal sentenced him to life imprisonment, in Dhaka February 8, 2013. REUTERS-Andrew Biraj

There is, however, little to no coverage of this historic uprising in Pakistan.

What disappoints me is the fact that there is no imminent chance of any similar movement in our country.

Just the other day, hundreds of homes belonging to Christians were burnt by a frenzied mob supposedly avenging blasphemy. Similar treatment was meted out to Christian localities in Gojra and Shantinagar, in 2009 and 1997 respectively.

In the last one and a half years, hundreds of Shias have been killed hither and thither in Pakistan, just because of their religious beliefs. To achieve anything even close to the Shahbag movement, religion and politics will need to be separated and kept apart.

There is widespread confusion about the term ‘secular’ in the educated class of Pakistan. Being secular, however, does not mean anti-religion per se, as is thought by our masses; it means freedom to choose your religion and not interfere in other people’s religion.

The first person to translate secularism as “la-deeniyat” or atheism was the founder of Jamaat-e-Islami in one of his books written in 1939.

Things have deteriorated so badly in our country that no political party is willing to stand up to religious fundamentalists as elections approach.

A trend has been observed in different countries that the emerging middle classes usually patronise the religious lot, giving them political leverage. This trend has been bucked in Bangladesh’s case and they have chosen a different path. However, what remains to be seen is whether or not the mobilised Bangladeshi youth in Shahbag Square are gathering in support of out-and-out secularism or just animosity towards the Jamaat mixed with nationalistic feelings.

A student from the University of Dhaka shouts a slogan as she attends a mass demonstration at Shahbagh intersection, demanding capital punishment for Bangladesh's Jamaat-e-Islami senior leader Abdul Quader Mollah, after a war crimes tribunal sentenced him to life imprisonment, in Dhaka February 8, 2013. REUTERS-Andrew Biraj

Whatever the case may be, Bangladesh has decided that it won’t let the country be hijacked by politicians peddling their agendas in the name of religion.

Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Mr Jinnah wanted to create.

PHOTOS: REUTERS 

Read more by Abdul here or follow him on Twitter @abdulmajeedabid

Abdul.Majeed

Abdul Majeed

A final year medical student with interests in history, political economy and literature. He blogs at abdulmajeedabid.blogspot.com/ and tweets as @abdulmajeedabid

The views expressed by the writer and the reader comments do not necessarily reflect the views and policies of The Express Tribune.

  • Awabnavi

    “Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Mr Jinnah wanted to create.” –Recommend

  • Imran Hussain

    “Dekho mujhe jo deeda-e-ibrat nigah ho,
    Meri suno jo gosh-e-naseehat niyosh
    hai.” Mirza GhalibRecommend

  • Hawk

    [Pakistan’s textbooks are still silent over the atrocities committed by our armed forces and their proxies in 1971]…..Mr. First of all it is not necessary to exaggerate about your own history, every one knows who commited the sin and who didn’t. Just read some more rational wrtier’s hitory books, and one thing more by calling patriots as Pakistan Army’s Proxies shows your biased thinking about Pak Army. They were all patriots and sheded their blood for their motherland. By the way if they were proxies of Pakistan Army than who were “Mukti Bahnis”?
    .

    [Being secular, however, does not mean anti-religion.]………..That’s why your cult fellows have been killing innocent Muslims who believe something related to Islam since the begining of this so called “Uprising”.
    .

    [Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Mr Jinnah wanted to create.]……you can’t justify it ever from history books and the actions of Mr jinnah that Mr. Jinnah wanted to create a country of such people who will belong to secular cult!
    Recommend

  • Sry

    “Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Jinnah wanted to create”

    You know what? It really shouldn’t matter to us what a man with roots in Gujarat expected from us (Pakhtoons, Baloch, Sindhis, Punjabis) .I realise that the point of the blog is a bit different, but I will take this opportunity to talk about this trend of evoking guilt in us about letting Jinnah down.

    Jinnah had zero knowledge of the land we now call Pakistan (Thatta to Chitral) and he went about creating a country in that area. The reason Pakistan has failed so miserably is because it has no solid foundation whatsoever, and you’d think that that’s something the Father of the Nation would have taken into consideration.
    If Jinnah cared so much about us Muslims of North-west India, he should have done a short reading on the people living here and left us alone ( whether that meant being in India or outside it).Recommend

  • Left is Right

    Whatever the case may be, Bangladesh has decided that it won’t let the country be hijacked Recommend

  • Tabish Bilgrami

    Indeed a positive step. Perhaps its very late at our end, now people demanding such a change in Pakistan will easily be out numbered….Recommend

  • Amit

    As usual to the point,crisp and unambiguous.keep writing doctor sahibRecommend

  • Ravi

    Bangladesh has a better record than Pakistan, but they also have a long history of atrocities against their minorities, especially Hindus. The religion of Islam is against democracy, equality of people and minorities, and that cannot be changed.Recommend

  • Bilal

    “Pakistan’s textbooks are still silent over the atrocities committed by our armed forces and their proxies in 1971″

    and did you read about this in Indian textbooks??? Please spare us from your half cooked facts which directly originated from Indian sources. 1971 war was a war of propaganda and deceit. The main villains were India and Mukti bahni’s ruthless militia. Pakistani army might have taken some actions to curb the civil war (created by Mukti Bahni), As would any other army do in such scenario. just like India is doing in Kashmir, North East and against Naxals, tell that to Indians on their face and they will put you to your sense. Repeating a lie 1000 times would not make it a fact. Recommend

  • Fiza

    A similar movement is needed in Pakistan. Religion and state should be kept separate to safeguard the spirit of both. We are doing a disservice to Islam by keeping it as a state religion and then committing crimes in the name of religion. In a secular state all Pakistanis will live peacefully and practice their own faith without any fear.

    Also, the state will be prosperous as the so called leaders will not be able to manipulate people in the name of religion. Recommend

  • Aliya

    Fed up of ignorant young Pakistanis like you who have no idea what the Mukti Bahini did to Non-Bengali settlers and West Pakistanis living in East Pakistan. Atrocities were committed by all sides in 1971 and to blame one side exclusively is simply not fair. Nobody was punished except the poor abandoned Biharis who were made a convenient scapegoat by the Bengalis. Recommend

  • http://India vasan

    Bilal : Pathetic comments defending pak army. Pl read your own commission’s report ieHamoodur Rehman commission. More importantly find out why it was never made public till it got leaked out.Recommend

  • http://India Feroz

    While the youth of Bangladesh have to be congratulated for trying to put their country first and not religion, I think their project may get derailed by saboteurs. Arms and Money is in free flow from Islamic countries mostly from the Gulf, into the Jamaat coffers.
    Bangladesh citizens are mostly secular but the Jamaat – e – Islami has been injecting poison into the veins for decades. Its record in annihilating minorities is also better. In 1950 census Bangladesh had 30% Hindu population, today it is down to 8.5%. The country still offers hope. Recommend

  • Ali

    @Author:
    Your ignorance is astoundingly frustrating. You are saying giving death sentences to politicians at the behest of government, not following due process and banning a whole class of people from political discourse is progress. This is a MURDER of liberalism and democracy. This is the worst possible use of public office and power. This is fascism. Killing your political opponents.. I am truly dumbfounded at the shallowness of the philosophy that guides your opinion. Recommend

  • A Peshawary

    @Fiza:
    Which state on earth is living in peace, USE where there daily massacres in Schools and Universities, or India where gang rapes are norm of the day.
    By the Pakistan is being manipulated in the name of national interest and law of necessity than in the name of religion. There is not doubt name of religion is also being highly misused. So, religion may not singled out for all atrocities.

    A Peshawary Recommend

  • afzaalkhan

    Just like mukti bahini did Awami League doing same to opposition in Bangladesh, so how many have been killed so far protesting govt? Awami league was partner in coalition with JI in mid 2000′s funny they didn’t remember atrocities then. Ppl like author are doing propaganda themselves, 1st try mukti bahini then talk to us about any Pak army atrocities.

    I really wish we should have Indian style laws to deal with blogs like this and paper like ET Recommend

  • Ali

    @Author
    If you had been reading news about Bangladesh more closely you would have realized these so called massive protests are government staged.. GOVERNMENT STAGED. Kindly read up on the issue or topic before. Better yet, talk to a Bangladeshi, a Bengali friend of mine and his family and cousins are in fear of their lives because they are against the misuse of power by the current government. Young boys, who had nothing to do with Shahbag, who were not even born then, who simply support one or the other political party are in danger just because they believe the government should not bypass due process to hand out death sentences to it’s opponents and murder and baton charge peaceful protesters.
    Recommend

  • Ali

    @Fiza:
    Kindly read up on common law, civil law, systems of government and what actually the sharia is (I bet you don’t even know what the word means) before spewing any more ignorance in the comments section of any forum. People, please for the love of the earth, educate yourselves.Recommend

  • A Peshawary

    Why to drag poor Jinnah into everything? He was practical political leader with lots of good and bad, please let him rest in peace now. He had nothing to do with ideology of Bangladesh or the present day movement over there.

    Bangladesh is reality of its own with no connection or relevance to geographical or social settings of Pakistan. There is a movement going on with all he implications for themselves only with not repercussions to Pakistan except sending more people to Pakistan to overburden its economy in case of insecurity to venerable of the society.

    A PeshawaryRecommend

  • Ahsan Habib

    Can you explain me how India is treating Muslims all around India? How many Muslim killed every year in riot by fanatic Hindus ? Before made a comment you better think about yourself first. @ RAVIRecommend

  • Tareq Ahamed

    @Aliya:

    It is not right that Biharis were made a convenient scapegoat by the Bengalis….Bengalis did not make anyone scapegoat…..Biharis are still living in Bangladesh with honour. Biharis fought jointly with the then Pakistan Army against Bengalis but it was the Pakistani Army who abandoned them here. After the independence of Bangladesh our great leader Sheikh Mujibir Rahman pardoned even those Biharis who were involved in killing of innocent Bengalis during the war. Recommend

  • BlackJack

    The comments show that Pakistanis are only willing to go on believing the lies that they have been fed over the years. People who are asking about Mukti Bahini atrocities don’t recognize that this group did not even exist at the time when Mujibur Rehman won the elections in 1970 and should have become PM of Pakistan. Consider the level of atrocities that need to be committed to alienate the majority population of a country. But for you guys, these current protests are staged, the Mukti Bahini were terrorists (while strangely, the Kashmiri militants are freedom fighters), 9/11 and 26/11 were inside jobs, the Taliban are funded by RAW/ CIA/ Mossad, Polio vaccinations are a CIA front, Jews control the banks, Hafiz Saeed is a social worker, Dawood Ibrahim is a philanthopist and Bollywood is a Hindu Zionist communications vehicle.Recommend

  • Tareq Ahamed

    Thanks Abdul Majeed…..nice write-up. Recommend

  • Fiza

    @ Bilal: I was avoiding to comment on the Bangladesh part as i thought that its water under the bridge.But now that you have opened up the Pandora’s box, its incumbent on me to share some facts which were never mentioned due to Indian’s propaganda, which completely distorted the truth.

    These (Mukti bahni) freedom fighter were trained and brainwashed in India.The insurgence and the atrocities by (Mukti bahni) started way before the announcement regarding the postponement of elections by yahya Khan. some events will shed light as to what instigated the army to take extreme action against these rebels:

    -Non bengalis were murdered brutally. There was a colony near Kanna Paper Mill in Chittagong, occupied by non-bangalis which was torched. All men and women were killed, no one was spared.

    -An army detachment in Tangain was slaughtered

    -The non-bengali army officers were singled out and killed. Their wives were raped.

    -East Bengal Regiment killed all their Non-bengoli officers.

    After the announcement of postponement of elections in news, everyone took to the streets and the movement started in full swing, killing every one (non-bengalis) who came in the way. Of course pak army had to take action as any other army would do in such circumstances.

    India still has a very strong hold in Bangladesh to an extend that even the Govt is elected with their consent. I cant say if they better off or worse without us, with India constantly meddling in their affairs. Eventually if they had waited it out they would have formed a govt being the majority — better than being under the thumb of India.

    @Author:
    Presenting one side of the picture is never fair. Both sides owe an apology to each other. Recommend

  • Panoo

    Secularism does not mean banning political parties and politically victimizing them. That’s fascism.Recommend

  • Inam Ullah

    Indeed Bangladeshis is a role model for Pakistani leaders. Here in Pakistan , extremism and fundamentalism have made deep roots in society and its state institutions. Unfortunately our religious junta is playing double and dubious role in state affairs regarding on going so called war on terrorism. Recommend

  • shiraj

    about the uprising in Bangladesh in sahbagh it is all political issues if the bangladesh government is so concern about the war criminial are you telling me that there are only five jamate along with otheres who are suspect of war activities if the government thinks that these are only peoples than you as the government should look into these matters deep context not just these peoples sheik mujubur did the same in 1972 and see what happen jamat islami did not kill his family his own loyal peoples did why becoz he thought he was the only person to dictate people of bd what you do bad you always pay for it and in my belief sheik hasina will be the next gadaffi i hope she realise what is going on in bd Recommend

  • Mani

    Wow, the ignorance of the people commenting Here is Actually depressing !
    Yes, the mukti Bahni Played a part in the civil war, but lets not forget how badly We west pakistanis treated the now bangladeshis ! We denied Them their rights including the rights to Language And the right To form government. They were trod upon by the west and had a Perfectly valid reason to protest. What The pakistani Army Did after they realized they Had lost Was cruel and an atrocious massacre of the nations professionals. Their is no use of denying it, it happened and we Cannot Change it.
    Yes india too Has a minority Problem, with Muslims targeted but this article is Not about India or what Its doing, its About how We persecuted the Majority Of our population who Werent Even of A different Religion. That is Just Abominable ! And are we so Horribly low, that we Will justify the persecution of a people just because another country Does So ? What sort of justice is that and how can Any human with a shred of a heart Live with That !
    Oh and people PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD stop trying To prove that Pakistan Is The perfect country which is innocent as A New born, because it isnt ! We have done horrible things in the pas and in the present, we need to accept That And Stop blaming India for just about everything ! We ourselves outlr responsible GROW UP .
    And author it Was A very Interesting Article, i Agree with you but perhaps you should’ve Added a Bit more of an explanation about What it Was That Jinnah wanted !Recommend

  • Jakir

    What the people are calling for in shahbag is more islamic, in essence then what jamat-e-islam has ever called for, I.e. justice and fairness and a against currouptions, they have also been an example of islamic behaviour holding peaceful demos, unlike Jamat-e-islam who have burned poor peoples rickshaws bus taxis, attacked hindu minorities, distroyed their homes. I think thier mrmbers are also commiting shirk (major sin) blind loyalty and love for their leaders and they are ready to go to war with bangladesh if necessary. Jamat are a shame. Alot of the intelectual reporters, of pakistan have clearly taken the side of Jamat, who are onely trying to distroy the country. Im glad to see this honest article and reporting comming from Pakistan.Recommend

  • Raj

    @Ahsan Habib:
    Can you tell me where are you getting these bogus facts? In India all citizens irrespective of religious affiliation have equal rights. There can be individuals who are discriminatory but then again every religion has their share of such people.

    So stop dreaming and listening to concocted stories and rather try to make things better in your country. Forget the minorities in Pakistan or the Bangladeshis, the kind of treatment you offer to Ahmadis and Shias are disgusting. Muslims are far better in India with better education and job opportunities and you will do good if you can provide the similar facilities to Muslims in PakistanRecommend

  • Indian

    @Ahsan Habib ji, Ever been to India?
    95-98% muslims are treated well here. We really are , by and far, a free country. Please don’t believe the propaganda you believe.
    Come to Kerala , Mangalore or Maharashtra, you will find muslims are treated equally because religion has nothing to do with the running of our country and state. Recommend

  • Nadir

    Who is Jinnah? Quaid-e-Azam made Pakistan!!Recommend

  • http://USA Observer

    Mr. Jinnah was an attorney who fought a case to protect the land holdings of the feudal lords. He had to give it a political twist because it was a matter of creating a separate state. His vision was to win a case. The rest is what has been invented in his name to create the aura of a larger than life personality.

    Bangladesh has indeed done the right thing by taking these steps against Jamat e Islami.

    What most people don’t understand is that Islam has been distorted by such groups.

    Pakistan better do the same thing and exterminate these religious groups or they themselves will face extermination. Recommend

  • Vivek

    @Ahsan Habib

    The proof of the pudding is the eating, and since you feel that way, let us have an exchange of minority populations to each other countries like this:

    a. Sikhs, Hindus and Christians from Pakistan to India. Ahmediyyas, Bahais. and other assorted groups cannot be included, since their status of being a muslim or not is undecided.
    b. Minority groups from India to Pakistan: This includes any Sikhs, Christians, Buddhists, Jain and of course muslims.

    I am sure a lot of minorities from India especially muslims would immediately pack up their bags and leave for Pakistan with Shahrukh Khan, Shaban Azmi, Emraan Hashmi, Salman Khan being the leaders of the pack.

    LOLLLRecommend

  • Babloo

    There is a reason why the news of secular section of Bangladesh society rising up against the religious fundamentalist party of Bangladesh is ignored or very poorly covered in Pakistan press. It makes Pakistan very uncomfortable.Recommend

  • Iftekhar

    Thanks for writing up this piece. To assure you the under current of Shahbag movement is out-and-out secularism.Recommend

  • Shinwari

    So unfortunate that the only party which tried to protect Pakistan in 1971, and helped Pakistan army in good faith (though got exploited in the end), is not finding any sympathizers in the country with whom they remained faithful. The so called liberals have taken upon themselves to “rectify” the Pakistani history. Nobody in India blames there Government for interfering in Pakistan’s affairs by sending forces into the then east Pakistan. But we have gems like Mr. Abdul Majid who can’t stop being sorry for their existance.

    Mr. Author, the problem is with people like you who are unable to find a Pakistani nationalism. I don’t know what kind of ideology do you want to promote by being self deprecating at every step. Jamaat-e-Islami in Bangladesh still bags more national assembly seats than its counter part in Pakistan. Recommend

  • Indian query

    @Ahsan Habib,

    I am an Indian. I dont know a single Muslim who has been killed in the last ten years in India in any riot.I dont recall any riot after 2002. Plz clarify.Recommend

  • Historian 1

    Why dictators love to implement/ impose Islam?? This reminds us once again ” religion is the opium for masses”Recommend

  • vijay

    @Ali:
    Please read carefully, it is International Crimes Tribunal (ICT)Recommend

  • Parvez

    If the Bengali youth are doing this and taking a stand, then more power to them………………because they are doing the right thing.Recommend

  • Yuri Kondratyuk

    @Ahsan Habib:
    FYKI, the last major riot started in Muslim majority area and even the previous one have shown similar trends.
    Besides, I believe, Pakistan sees more violence against Muslims than India does.Recommend

  • vijay

    @Ahsan Habib:
    You tell us how many Indian Muslims are killed ever year. You must be maintaining statistic.Last Hindu Muslim Gujarat riots took place more than 15 years back and they were initiated by Muslims . How many Muslims, Hindu and Christian are killed everyday in your country?Recommend

  • Moz

    @A Peshawary:

    daily massacres in schools, which world do you live in? Unlike Pakistan, perpetrators either kill themselves or are punished by courts, which may be something alien to you. Yes religion may not be singled out, except for the fact that wars and violence in the name of religion has been going on for thousands of years. So what do you say about that??Recommend

  • Moz

    @Ali:

    We don’t care what sharia law is?? we don’t want this evil imposed on us, just as you don’t was secularism. And I know what sharia is?? it requires a women to produce 4 witnesses for a rape or she will be the one punished, it requires death sentence for apostates, minority religions to pay extra tax or get killed, ban on any kind of music, stoning to death for adultery, chopping off a thieves hands regardless if he had stolen 10 rupees or 10 carors, and pretty much a tool to oppress people. So yeah I know what sharia is. Recommend

  • Javed Baba

    @Sry: Blaming Jinnah for the corruption and incompetency of the leaders that followed doesn’t seem like the right thing to do. And for you to invoke where Jinnah’s roots were is stupid. Doesn’t matter he was from Gujrat or Chitral – there was a whole movement behind the creation of Pakistan not a unilateral act by a lone ranger. Why don’t you pick up a book or two and understand the context. Recommend

  • Dr KV Ranjit

    The only solution to the rampant fundamentalism in both Pakistan and BANGLADESH is for both countries to reunite with India.Since the fundamentalits&terrorists who and their patrons are flourishing in both BANGLADESH and Pakistan in the name of fighting India but sorely lack courage thus ending up fighting among themselves as well as cowardly attacks on minority groups and temples,churches and mosques Recommend

  • aBangladeshi

    @Tareq Ahamed:
    Don’t talk nonsense, I lived at least 10 year in Mohammadpur (the main BiharI camp). These people are caught in Pakistan dream and was (still is) convenient scapegoat without any nationality. Indeed many were killed during and after 1971 by extreme Bengali nationalist. No one in Bangladesh mention this. The current Awami League govt has started the trial just weaken BNP so that they can stay in power longer. Recommend

  • Old Wise Man

    @Hawk:

    May God Bless You!!!Recommend

  • Alex

    @Ahsan Habib:

    such is your level of prejudice that I had to give this link to read about INDIA. For all who argue with religious arrogance, here is the write up by a PAKISTANI ON INDIA:

    http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=20133\16\story16-3-2013pg3_5

    Just published YESTERDAY!!Recommend

  • Waqas

    Seriously? Read the following for a more nuanced view – religious, yes, but nuanced.
    http://muslimmatters.org/2013/03/16/the-bangladesh-crisis-explored/Recommend

  • Bengaliamerican

    Your logic of over generalization is an insult to all South Asians. Please refrain from attacking an entire religion since India (hindu’s) has one of the worst religious intolerance record in the the modern World, by the way, I am a die hard secularist who believes in freedom of religion. @Ravi: Recommend

  • Bengaliamerican

    Islam is totally compatible with democracy, never forget that to say “All men are created equal” was a death sentence prior to Islam. The current puppet rulers of Muslim states, especially the oil producing one’s do NOT represent Islam or it’s core values, therefore the only solution is to separate religion and state without persecuting any religion and protecting the minority religions. Pakistan should be a peaceful thriving nation if the rulers adhered to the fundamental principles of Islam following the assassination of Liaquat Ali, sad but true. Having said that, India is the last country in the World that is the model to emulate.Recommend

  • PakArmySoldier

    You bet it has. Recommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com Anoop

    “Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Mr Jinnah wanted to create.”

    That is soo not true.

    Quoting Jinnah.

    Some are misled by propaganda.
    Islamic principles are as applicable
    to life as they were 1,300 years ago.
    The Constitution of Pakistan will be
    made on the basis of the sharia.

    So has Sharia been implemented in Bangladesh? Its also not been implemented in Pakistan either completely(I don’t understand why such a perfect system conceptualised for the whole mankind, but especially for Muslims isn’t being implemented in 97% Muslim majority Pakistan!).

    Jinnah wanted a Sharia compliant Constitution. Bangladesh is moving away from all that, into the warm embrace of the kind of dream Nehru had for India.

    A Secular, Democratic, Socialist, Republic. That Nehru wanted. The very fact that Jinnah wanted Sharia means he was not game for a Secular set-up like Nehru wanted and got in India.

    Do not twist Jinnah into what you want him to be, please. If you want I can quote Jinnah more…

    Your whole article is fine and good but for the last part. Bangladesh day by day is becoming more like India. Their national poet is Rabindranath Tagore. They speak an Indian tongue and don’t claim its a Bangladeshi one and don’t claim to have Arab ancestors.Recommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com Anoop

    @Ahsan Habib:

    If you could name a few of those Hindu riots in India in 2012, I’d be very grateful. Recommend

  • Vivek

    @Dr KV Ranjit

    Thanks, but no thanks. Please do not make us victims of your fantasies. If you want you can always go to Pakistan or Bangladesh.Recommend

  • SD

    @Dr KV Ranjit:

    I beg your pardon, Sir. I think you are in a very insignificant minority of Indians if you want to reunite India, Pakistan and Bangladesh. If a general poll is taken on this subject in India, I think the overwhelming people will reject the idea. Recommend

  • Furqan

    @Mani

    pour some water on your enthusiasm, no one said Pakistan is perfect society. what we are saying is an alternative view point, which we no one talks about. if you ask me, i dont hate Bangaalis, neither would you or many other people like us. But when we talk about 1971 we should talk about both sides of stories, without the fear of being labeled as apologist or defeated, and shouldn’t only blame Pak army in a try to get labeled as liberals.Its annoying when young Pakistanis adopt this line of thinking which in the first place was developed by Indian propagandist. Recommend

  • Sry

    @ Javed Iqbal: The area that is now Pakistan barely had a movement, the main enthusiasm was on the part of the Bengalis and muslims in (present) India. The people of this area were too politically backward to have major movements (Bacha Khan’s Khidmatgar’s were limited to Pakhtun nation, and there too not ALL Pakhtuns)

    And why shouldn’t I blame Jinnah? If a man creates a country, one thing that man must have is limitless love for his land; and if Jinnah did then why didn’t he realise that lumping together such disparate peoples in the name of Islam would lead to disaster.

    And didn’t Jinnah make the famous ” Meri jaib mein sarey sikey khotey hain” statement, referring to the fact that he was surrounded by incompetent nawabs. It is grossly irresponsible to first create a country, decide the fate of millions, and then check up on whether you have good enough politicians to run the place.

    But I do cut him some slack since I know that he was mostly just a tool in the hands of Britons and nawabs.Recommend

  • Fiza

    @All Indian: Its a fallacy that in India all minorities are treated equally. Yes Pakistan has its share of problems, but things in India are not completely hunky dory. You need to first give the untouchable their rights. You think we are naive, we don’t know what’s happening in Kashmir and other Muslim areas. Get a life and stop exaggerating please.

    Before you start pointing our faults put your house in order first and stop this propaganda. You need to first improve law and order in your country where rape cases are rampant. Your society is as conservative as ours, if not more. Recently, a Swiss woman was gang raped and her face was covered…why? because in a conservative society rape victim have a stigma attached to them. Exact wordings of the article i read.

    Whats causing these crimes? a distorted sex ratio between men and women due to female infanticide and a rise in sex selective abortions. The cultural preference for sons in India is well known which has given rise to skewed sex ratio to an extend that has resulted in bride shortage. Plus there is abject poverty in India that needs to dealt with. Female foeticide to satti, acid throwing, rape, and then brutally killing them and all forms of violence against women mock your claims of equality in india.

    There are extremist elements in Hindus as well. have you read how many Christians are beaten, killed and harassed for practicing their faith. Read about how Hindu Extremists are free to attack Christians in Thane District where police are mere spectators. I can write a book on extremism in your country against minorities. Please stop living in denial. At least in Pakistan we are acknowledging our problems.

    @Dr KV Ranjit:
    Reunite with India….dream on!Recommend

  • Bilal

    I am in Dhaka right NOW (am here for a IT consultancy for a large enterprise here) and I can’t tell how incorrect and off the mark this article is. The country is no where near Jinnah’s dream and is not even a remote mimicry of what Jinnah talked about in his speeches. Author only took few random incidents and in a skewed way, started using them. Dude, read history and get your facts correct.Recommend

  • A.Sathyamurthy

    The very title of the blog says it all. While Pakistan is a negative example of what a country should not be like, Bangladesh seems to have emerged from confusion to be really a country free from religious bigotry. It is in being ‘secular’ that the future of Bengalis (yes, all those who belong to Bangladesh, irrespective of their religion) lie. Hope Bangladesh succeeds.Recommend

  • PK

    @Tareq Ahamed:

    and wht did GREAT Sheikh Mujeeb do when his own son was involved in a RAPE…???????

    Wht his Hassena doing regarding the attrocities commited by the Mukhti bhani during the so called genocide war of Bangladesh????? My family who were killed openly in the streets of Dhaka till now didnt recieve any Justice…..
    Read histroy books with non Bengali authors…same advice goes to other Pakistanis and Bengalis..who have no idea wht they are talking about.Recommend

  • Nitish

    For me,both Pakistan and Bangladesh fulfill jinnah’s dream….These both countries more or less achieved his wish…Recommend

  • Lamss

    Your last line gave me the chills…. in a good way. Really something to think about. Especially with where Pakistan is at today.Recommend

  • anwar kamal

    First we are Bangalee.Then muslim.We want secular state.Recommend

  • aba

    @Raj:
    Hahahaha nice joke i think you are forgetting recen killings in AssamRecommend

  • M.S.Choudhury

    To understand the Shahbagh movement we need to know some dynamics of Bangladeshi politics. All that is happening in Bangladesh is revolving around who will rule the country after 2013.Here the all apparatus of the nation including the judiciary, administration, police, academics, media and even professional and trade bodies have been made partisan. The opposition does not believe the government and vice versa. No fair election can be held under any political government.
    The Awami League (AL) government has changed the constitution, where the care taker government has been done away with and election will be held under AL government and that too three months before the term of the parliament‘s term expires, where the sitting MP will contest against an aspiring MP .The opposition parties refuse to participate in such an election. AL wants some parties to participate in the election to give it some credibility.
    The Shahbagh movement started after the Tribunal’s verdict against Abdul Kader Molla, where he was given life sentence. The original organizers of the movement thought that there has been an underhand understanding between Jamat E Islami and government as a result Molla was given life term instead of death sentence with the understanding that Jamat E Islami will participate in the next general election.
    The government party found the Shahbagh movement was going against them, it slowly took over the control of the movement, pushing the non party nature of the movement to the sidelines. A movement which started as a common people movement became a AL and left party dominated movement. The public slowly left the movement and now it is a government sponsored, feed and protected one. A common people’s movement has become a partisan one.
    Bangladeshi people are non communal, we believe that every citizen has equal right .This can be seen the number of minorities in civil service, police, teaching profession and media. This is far higher than their population ratio. The burning and destruction of Hindu houses and temples have been condemned by every Bangladeshi except a few .However; the big questions is who are the people who have done this heinous crime? The government and the opposition points fingers at each other. No enquiry committee has been set up by the government to identify the criminals. There are reports that the ruling party cadres are involved in the crime so as to put the blame on the opposition and to get political mileage. There is a report in at least two Indian newspapers and there is also an article published by a Hindu lady from Bangladesh accusing the ruling party of the vandalism. To clear the air the government should institute a judicial enquiry commission. We the common people have high regards for all religion; we believe that every religious group has equal rights in our country. We have been tainted by some political parties who have put politics above nation.Recommend

  • Ahmed

    This writer Recommend

  • Rameez

    Article from our Pakistani newspaper Daily times from March 16th
    http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=20133\16\story16-3-2013pg3_5

    “COMMENT : Democracy and Indian Muslims — Tufail Ahmad” , Google it if you want.

    Many people will not believe what is written in that article because the author Tufail Ahmad is of Indian Origin. Just like Fareed Zakaria.

    Similarly Pakistanis refuse to believe any of the mainstream news on India. We just want to believe and tag on to the fringe news – the rapes, the Sati, infanticide etc …. to fulfill our fears that India has not progressed … that it is still like us .. that we have not been left behind in the club which now comprises of Somalia, Yemen and Afghanistan type countries.
    We do not want to laud the efforts of our arch rival to break from the social ills and other issues to move forward and join the western club. We want it to stay back in the cess pool that we are in.

    Such thinking will not help us. We are slipping, they are moving on ahead and out of our hemisphere …Recommend

  • Nobody

    Radical elements exist all over the subcontinent in the form of secular violence and plain and simple prejudice against one another (unfortunately those leech-like fundamentalist mullahs have spread all over and infested the place like diseased rats), but the difference is Bangladesh and India at least attempt to take measures to put a stop to it before these elements gain too much ground. Despite Pakistanis (on average) being AGAINST the radicals and what they stand for, nobody seems to actually DO anything. What a shame. From Jinnah’s vision to what we see today….

    Any party affiliated with religion doesn’t have a place in a civilized society anymore. It’s unfortunate for those who may not have a radical outlook, but it is what it is. They’ve shot their own credibility… that little which they may have ever had in the first place. Recommend

  • amir jafri

    @Anoop:
    Thank you saroop for instilling this raw and naked TRuth into the minds of Paki liberaloon, secularoons, murtadoons and WESTOXICATED riffraff…Jinnah WAS for shariah and for the very fact that he tabled and got enacted the in 1935 India for Waqf Bill and for a separate Muslim Law for Muslimsof India ( still in full force)…and MUSLIM Pakistanis love respect and adore Quaid Azam precisely for this. …Never ever mistake form for substance…Jinnah was pure substance, inside. THe liberaloons and secularoons are trying stupidl;y and comicall;y hard to preach to their own types….

    and in Bangladesh it is just a phase…and it’ll pass…Recommend

  • Biased

    Well no country in the world would ever admit their mistakes or atrocities to the other or their opponents. So why would any country teach their people in history they did they did that.Recommend

  • mind control

    Maybe Bangladesh has become the country Jinnah wanted to create

    Maybe Bangladesh avoided being the country Jinnah wanted to create.Recommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com Anoop

    @Nobody:

    “Any party affiliated with religion doesn’t have a place in a civilized society anymore.”

    Balderdash.

    The Tibetian struggle is political as well as spiritual. Any Political party affiliated with any Religious ideology, which seeks, power in numbers and imposes medieval rules is bad. And, not all Religious ideologies do that.

    In India we have the BJP. They are not that different from Congress. They both have blood on their hands. BJP doesn’t twist the ideology it professes to follow. Its violence is purely for gains and getting votes. Same with the Congress.

    But, they are flexible. India needs Left, Right, Centrist, Left-Centrist and Right-Centrist parties. Basically parties of all colours.

    Britain is Constitutionally a Christian country, so is Ireland.

    Do not generalize. Recommend

  • http://[email protected] Burjor

    Simply put the Bengali’s are more sensible, more politically mature, more literate, more aware, more secular, than the general public in Pakistan. They have a history, they have a common language, they are aware of their geography, and they are a proud people with a proud culture, with a proud history.
    Perhaps more than any other factor is that they are aware that the West Pakistani establishment, Pakistani politicians, used religion as a political tool to hoodwink Bengali’s into believing that they have an equal share, equal ownership, equal rights, equal finances, equal representation in the running of the country, just because they are Muslims.The truth came out in 1971. Religion was only a tool for continued suppression used by West Pakistani’s against the Bengali’s, nothing more, the Bengali’s learnt their lesson, Pakistani’s have not, Mullah’s continue their unabated, chronic, brainwashing on whoever, and wherever possible. After 40 years Bangladesh, has a brighter future by far than Pakistan.
    How do Pakistani text books describe the 1971 war? we are not truthful with our history, therefore we can never learn from history,” those who do not learn from history are bound to repeat it “. Recommend

  • Talib

    @Ramiz: This is a very vague article. Where are the facts?

    How many muslims are educated?
    How many Muslims have high level jobs?
    How many muslims live above poverty line?

    No one is saying that pak doesn’t have problems or that India hasn’t progressed at all. Yes it is way ahead of pak with its growing economy but to say that there is no extremism in India or that the minorities live in complete peace would be a lil too optimistic.

    @Fiza
    I agree that Pak ought to be a secular state and religion and state should not be mixed.

    @Nobody: Spot on, ban all these religious parties in pak. That’s the only way to progress and compete with our arc rival.Recommend

  • The Verdict

    WOW!!!After reading all the comments on this blog and generally on other blogs, I have come to the conclusion that there is no nationalism in Pakistan. And i have noticed a trend that no matter how wrong or way out of line the Indians are, we support their arguments. In fact we dis our own people, turn a blind eye towards Indian atrocities, and praise it unnecessarily. I have also noticed that these Indians are taking too keen an interest in Pakistan and they gang up against whoever tries to say anything against India; That’s how patriotic they are..shame on us!!!! If you are so keen to learn something from these Indians, learn Patriotism and unity first. Liberalism does not mean dissing our own country. Let me get this straight to all the supporters of India, its not a perfect state as they portray it. How is it that they are never at fault? How come we are always at fault from 65 war to kargil.

    i would say cut the Cra*p out,..Please Mods let it through as you let all the Indians say what they want to against pak on this forum!

    @Author: Even Noam Chomsky was banned in USA for writing against the state. So much so for such a tolerant society. Get your facts straight first. We need nationalism, not distorted truth! and people like you brain wash our youth further. Recommend

  • Ali

    down with jamaat-e-so-called-islami!
    these guys are responsible fore the mess pakistan is in today!
    these people do not condemn shia genocide, minority harassment, and yet claim to be muslims! Recommend

  • Iqbal

    Writer,
    Its a nice effort to understand the latest movement in Bangladesh. You may also find it interesting that the participation of wemen in this demonestration is overwhelming. The duration of the gathering was also unprcedented in Bangladesh. The demonestration was peaceful and the staged many new ideas to show their orientation.
    Yes, Bangladesh is a peace loving country, tolerance on different opinions and beleifs are very common. Though you will find some occuraces there if you look through the history of its 42 years. Most of such incidences were created by the people who want to use the religion for their own purpose. People of Bangladesh is slowly learning the denger of believing those kind of people and there parties. This is an exhibition of that.
    Now the next part of the book is open for your kind reading, look at the peoples attitude towards the Jamat-BNP alliance, will they be accepted?…….Follow the scenario pls.Recommend

  • Sophie

    @ The Verdict: I agree but we tend to forget that all countries are biased when it comes to presenting the truth to its next generations.

    I also agree that India’s role cannot be forgotten in the uprising and blood shed of 1971 war. But we were weak internally and they saw an opportunity in that.

    Siachen is yet another reminder of India’s innocence and pure intentions as portrayed by the Indians. Lets not forget how India deployed its forces a few years ago at our border, inciting us for another war.

    The sikh movement was crushed brutally but how come no indian admits or write about it. They never accept their atrocities and brutality. Kashmir is not our concern but yet another example of Indian brutality. They are also trying to crush the uprising in Kashmir but the world is quiet. Their diplomacy is strong and our propaganda is weak! another reason is India is a big market for investors with great business opportunities.

    @Ali: All parties with religious orientation should be banned in PK. Recommend

  • Reddy

    jinnah wanted a theological state and he got one…..those people who crying about rapes in india(which is a deplorable thing)…but in pak even rapes are happening in the name of religion …if muslims were to be treated so badly in india …they would be itching to cross the border and become pure, if you can’t bear the way despicable hindu riot loving mob treating your multiverse islamia dna in india you can have your gates opened for 365 days …let’s see how many will cross..to keep the things balanced we will do the same thing for a day…let’s see how many will remain in pakistan …. aish!!! paki’s mouth run like a river Recommend

  • observer

    @Sophie:

    The sikh movement was crushed brutally but how come no indian admits or write about it.

    You do the same with TTP/ LeJ/ SSP/ JeM and no one will ask you to ‘admit or write’ about it.

    Kashmir is not our concern but yet another example of Indian brutality. They are also trying to crush the uprising in Kashmir but the world is quiet.

    If it is not your concern, you keep quiet too.

    Their diplomacy is strong and our propaganda is weak!

    Hear, Hear! You just nailed it. When Diplomacy meets Propaganda, Diplomacy wins. Recommend

  • observer

    @The Verdict:

    Even Noam Chomsky was banned in USA for writing against the state. So much so for such a tolerant society.

    \Would you like to quote some evidence?

    Or should we believe that this has been ‘revealed’ to you alone?Recommend

  • Rameez

    @Talib: Take the article for what it is. Your choice. Not everything is black and white … there are some Grey areas that one has to be the personal judge of. Lack of numbers aside, I think qualitatively, I agree with somebody like the author Tufail Ahmad and somebody like Fareed Zakaria.
    I do not live in Pakistan any longer so you may call me biased. And, I have been to India multiple times – mainly for work.
    It seems most of us Pakistanis are looking for what can drag India down into the muck we are in. Misery loves company.
    We hate it when rightly or wrongly Indians try to portray themselves as ‘above us’. It almost scares us that India might get ahead , not only in economic field but also in social field.

    A vision of peaceful, well balanced progressive and secular society in India which leans on western values of freedom brings up emotions of fear and jealousy.Recommend

  • mind control

    @Sophie:

    The sikh movement was crushed brutally but how come no indian admits or write about it.

    You do the same with TTP/ LeJ/ SSP/ JeM ETC, and I assure you no one will ask you to ‘admit or write about it’.

    Kashmir is not our concern but yet another example of Indian brutality. They are also trying to crush the uprising in Kashmir but the world is quiet.

    If Kashmir is ‘not your concern’ why don’t you keep ‘quiet’ like the world?

    Their diplomacy is strong and our propaganda is weak!

    You finally got it right. Diplomacy wins over ‘Weak Propaganda’.Recommend

  • mind control

    @The Verdict:

    Even Noam Chomsky was banned in USA for writing against the state. So much so for such a tolerant society.

    Would you care ti cite some evidence for this, or do you expect us to accept your ‘verdict’?

    The last time I checked Prof Chomsky was still teaching at MIT, a federal funded University of USA. He was travelling all over the world, he was writing and publishing articles and was also seen on TV, as critical of US and its policies as ever.

    Recommend

  • Sophie

    @ Mind Control/ observer (how many different name do you use): Keep quiet so that you can continue with your propaganda and injustice? Kashmir is not our concern (it is yours though) but yet we will speak up against the inhumane treatment of kashrims by the Indian govn and military forces. Humanity calls for it whether you like it or not!

    You are comparing TTP/ LeJ/ SSP/ JeM ETC with Kashmir. from your definition then all Kashmirs are terrorists and that is why you subject them to such gross atrocities? If you think that it is a place for terrorists, let it go. Give them their independence they want. You talk about freedom of speech your Govt silences Kashmir press, silently. Police, CRPF continue to harass journalists , …
    Even then the Kashmir press does not have the liberty to report facts and … The Valley journalists are not allowed to express their genuine opinion …. To ensure safety and security of journalists to perform their duties freely.

    But of course India will never admit its mistake. How typical of all Indians. These atrocities and suppression in the name of nationalism and then denying it completely. And then you have the audacity to come on this forum and tell us that we were wrong in the 1971 war which was a similar freedom movement, instigated and sponsored by your government. At least we gave Bangladesh what they wanted, Its high time you should do the same with kashmir.

    Unfortunately your propaganda is stronger than your diplomacy…Recommend

  • Tareq Ahamed

    @aBangladeshi:

    Mr/Mrs Bangladeshi…..first I want to tell you that it is not a good manner to write hiding original name….Ok…you visited a camp of Biharis in Mohammadpur…they are living there without any basic civic facilities…it is true…but why? Our post liberation government urged Biharis to accept Bangladesh and stay here with Bengalis but it was the then Bihari leadership who refused to do so and wanted to go back to Pakistan. That government and also all other successive governments tried to send them to Pakistan…..but it is unfortunate that Pakistani governments since 1772 kept the matter hanging in balance for the last 41 years. If Biharis would have accepted Bangladesh and wanted to stay here as per the government’s decision in 1971, they would have been able to enjoy all civic facilities that are enjoying by Bengalis.

    Ok…now the Shahbag movement…..please don’t try to misguide the issue……it was the present government’s election pledge to hold trial of war criminals….and that election pledge was made during the election in 2009. And Awami League had been able to come to power by making such a pledge when Jamaat was with BNP….Nizami-Mujahid joined election campaign. Jamaat was failed to bring BNP back in power in 2009 election….So Awami League is holding trial of some front-raking leaders of Jamaat to weak BNP is not true…….BNP should stand on its own feet….deserting its dependence on Jamaat which is doing politics exploiting Islam…. Recommend

  • mind control

    @Sophie:

    Kashmir is not our concern (it is yours though)

    Yes it is. And you said it is not yours, I did not. So what are you protesting?

    You are comparing TTP/ LeJ/ SSP/ JeM ETC with Kashmir.

    Am I? Are you dyslexic or what? If you read carefully you will realise the response was to what you called ‘Sikh movement’ . Now you are confusing the Sikhs with the Kashmiris.

    And then you have the audacity to come on this forum and tell us that we were wrong in the 1971 war which was a similar freedom movement, instigated and sponsored by your government.

    Apparently you have never spoken to any Bangladeshis ever. And you have not heard of the Hamudoor Rehman Commission either.

    Recommend

  • mind control

    @Sophie:

    Here is a statement from you.

    Unfortunately your propaganda is stronger than your diplomacy…

    AND, here is another

    Their diplomacy is strong and our propaganda is weak!

    Tumhe Bhi Yaad Hai Kuchch Yeh Kalaam Kiska Tha? (with apologies to the poet)

    Recommend

  • Tablib

    @Rameez: After reading some of the comments I am not sure if you are an Indian pretending to be a Pakistani.

    Even if you are a Pakistani, my advise to you sir, please give up your nationality and opt for an Indian one. You deserve better. Happy now.

    No matter what you say, China is the emerging super power of the region. India should not worry about what we think as its biggest threat is China.

    As far as the article is concerned it is all grey (without any facts to support it) and seems like a politically motivated one. Recommend

  • http://peddarowdy.wordpress.com Anoop

    @Author,

    Your romantic notion of Jinnah was totally destroyed by Mr.Bangash in today’s ET column.

    http://tribune.com.pk/story/522703/jinnahs-pakistan

    Bangladesh is very far from becoming Jinnah’s Pakistan. It doesn’t want to be one either.Recommend

  • Tareq Ahamed

    @Fiza:

    Thank you Fiza…..it is the right comments of a real sensible person…….

    Tareq AhamedRecommend

  • Mehdi

    @Sophie:

    Your arguments are incoherent. Can you kindly explain your position. Your thoughts are every where. Pakistanis need to do more introspection than namaaz . Yes I am a Muslim. Recommend

  • Sophie

    @Mind control: Sikh Movement was also a freedom movement like Kashmir’s. So what difference does it make, India committed atrocities against its own people and now you call your own ppl terrorists? Yes I have spoken to bangaldeshis, but looks like you haven’t spoken to any kashmiri to understand their plight. Or may be you are too busy talking to the Bangladeshis and living in the past. Let bygones be bygones…lets talk about kahmir which is the present? They deserve their freedom!!!

    I remember that both statements are mine and they are not contradicting each other. I mean what i say and I say what i mean. Please don’t get too bogged down with my statements, if they are too confusing for you.

    since you have resorted to poetry, this one is for you (with no apologies to the poet)

    har ek baat pe kehte ho tum ke too kya hai?
    tumheen kaho ke yeh andaaz-e-guftgoo kya hai?Recommend

  • Mehdi

    @PK:
    How did you survive to tell your story in ET blog ? Pakistan army committed gross atrocities, in response to those atrocities few Biharis were killed by bangladeshi nationalist. This is a fact. West wing of pakistani government instituted a very biased approach in governing the Bengal province. Bengalis were treated unfairly in every aspect of governance. I live in US and I am extremely reluctant to meet punjabis from Pakistan, because they justify this atrocities till today.Recommend

  • mind control

    @Sophie:

    Sikh Movement was also a freedom movement like Kashmir’s.

    Oh, was it so? The Sikhs told you so? And what percentage came to you? Incidentally, the current Army Chief of India and the PM both are Sikhs.

    And since you are such an expert on freedom movements, what is the latest on Jiye Sindh/ Sidhudesh, Greater Pakhtunistan and Baloch Liberation movements.

    And now the million dollar question. Are TTP/ LeJ/ SSP/ JeM also ‘freedom movements’ or what? Deal with them for your own sake.Recommend

  • Sophie

    @Mind control: Your answer is evasive as usual. Fist talk about Kashmir and northeast India then we we will talk about other issues.

    What about Hyderabad?. Pls read the history how you got hold of the state? it was as usual by military invasion which was unlawful and unethical.

    But i agree that TTP/ LeJ/ SSP/ JeM need to be banned completely! It is good for us and good for you as well. Recommend